Interesting point Kevmul, however you have picked the wrong book to make an example of! British Gliders was 7/= (7 shillings) on launch and 35p after decimilisation, a direct translation (I've amended the table to show this more clearly). US Air Force Serials was priced 6/6 on launch July 1969, and by the time of decimilisation it had been reprinted and even the reprint was running low. The correct new pence price would have been £0.32 1/2 pence. In words, thirty-two and a half pence - such a difficult sum of money that my 2010 keyboard cannot cope with typing the 1/2 using one key! I cannot find what price US Air Force Serials 1941-1969 sold for post decimilisation as the 'Flypast' of the day does not state the price - and the book sales sheet supplements have long disappeared, but whether the 1/2 penny was kept, dropped or added on, I just do not know! It is true that British Gliders at 7/= was smaller than US Air Force Serials, but cost more - I fancy that the price difference is due to British Gliders having a very much smaller print run, (so higher per unit cost) and produced new a year later, at a time when 'inflation' was starting to enter the British vocabulary, although a while before it got a firm grip on the British economy.
Decimilisation change-over day of the UK currency was the 15th February 1971 with the change from Pounds, shillings and pence (£ s d) (with 12 pence to the shilling; and 20 shillings, or 240 pennies to the Pound) to simply 100 new pence to the Pound (£ np). Sometime later the 'new' being dropped.
Interesting observation and shows that at least one person has examined the list closely. I'm still digging to uncover the details to fill the spaces, but it was all a considerable time ago. Great times though for those around and involved.
It is 3 months since I compiled the listing shared a few posts back on the previous page. I have now, by complete chance, come across a list I compiled in late 1978 with a limited distribution of 6: self (MAS book sales), Ken Ellis (Editor Flypast and author), Phil Butler (author), Alan Schoefield (MAS Chairman), Brian Billington (Treasurer) and the Minutes Book. In my late 20s, would have never considered then that there would be interest in the list after I had retired! The great thing is that the list includes number of each title printed.
As the list has been so revised, I'll post as a new post and delete the previous one. To get in more columns, I've made greater use of abbreviations.
BOOKS PUBLISHED 1961-1986
Published Abbreviated Title Edition Compiled by pages Printed Price ISBN Printer Notes
1961 May The Irish Civil Register Proto1 PHB + GJRS 1/2d dup 1961 June Wrecks and Relics Ed.1 D.J. Stephens 600 2/6d dup 1962 May Aircraft of the Irish Rep. Proto2 2/6d dup 1962 June British Airfield Guide Ed.1 PHB + DJS 6-700? 2/6d dup 1962 July British Glider Markings Proto PHB + PS 100 2/6d dup 1963 Apr Wrecks and Relics Ed.2 D.J. Stephens 1000 3/6d R-X,B 1963 Jul Irish Aircraft Register Proto3 P.H. Butler 8 1500 2/= R-X,B 1963 Nov Scandinavian Civil Registers R.J. Goring 38 5/= Essex 1964 Jan French Civil A/c Register part 1 P.H. Butler 48 1000 4/6d R-X,B 1964 Apr Switzerland Civil Register R.J. Goring 26 800? 3/6d Essex 1963 Nov French Civil A/c Register part 2 P.H. Butler 46 1000 4/6d R-X,B 1963 Jan French Civil A/c Register part 3 P.H. Butler 44 1000 4/6d R-X,B 1964 Apr French Civil A/c Register part 4 P.H. Butler 16 1000 2/= R-X,B amendments/add's 1965 Nov British Isles Airfield Guide Ed.2 P.H. Butler 23 2000 4/= R-X,M 1968 May Wrecks and Relics Ed.3 S.G.Jones 60 3000 5/= R-X,M 1969 July USAF Serials 1946-1969 Ed.1 P. Danby 72 2000 6/6d none R-X,M 1970 Feb USAF Serials 1946-1969 Ed.2 P. Danby 72 2000 6/6d R-X,M amended reprint 1970 July British Gliders Ed.1 P.H. Butler 58 1000 7/= 9500780 2 R-X,M = £0.35np 1972 Feb British Isles Airfield Guide Ed.3 P.H. Butler 36 1000 £0.40 9500780 3 R-X,M 1972 Mar Irish Aircraft 1st P.H. Butler 72 1000 £0.70 9500780 4 R-X,M 1972 Mar British Isles Airfield Guide Ed.4 P.H. Butler 36 1000 £0.40 9500780 5 R-X,M amended reprint 1972 Apr "Aero"views '72 SGJ + RL 12 1000 none L Exp A4 format 1973 Feb US Navy Serials 1941-1972 Ed.1 P. Danby 78 2000 £0.60 9500780 6 R-X,M 1973 July British Isles Airfield Guide Ed.5 P.H. Butler 42 2000 £0.40 9500780 7 R-X,M 1973 Oct US Navy Serials 1941-1972 Ed.2 P. Danby 80 1000? £0.60 9500780 8 R-X,M amended reprint 1974 Mar Wrecks and Relics - 1 Repro (SGJ) 14 750 £0.25 none MAS A4 format,retyped 1974 May British Isles Airfield Guide Ed.6 P.H. Butler 44 1000 £0.45 902420 00 R-X,M error ISBN 02? 1974 June USAF Serials 1946-1974 Ed.3 P. Danby 92 2000 £0.90 902420 00 R-X,M 1974 Aug Wrecks and Relics Ed.4 K. Ellis 88 3000 £0.90 9500780 9 L Exp 1974 Nov A History of RAF Woodvale 1st A.P. Ferguson 30 1000 £0.35 902420 01 L Exp 1975 Jan USAF Serials 1946-1974 Ed.4 P. Danby 92 2000 £0.90 902420 03 R-X,M amended reprint 1975 May British Gliders Ed.2 P.H. Butler 72 1500 £0.80 902420 04 L Exp 1975 May History of the Short Skyvan MAS + UAS 32 1000 £0.30 902420 05 MAS A4 format stapled 1975 Dec British Hombuilt Aircraft Ed.1 K. Ellis 112 1000 £1.40 902420 06 Jones 1976 Mar British Independent A/L Vol.1 A.C. M Jones 120 3000* £2.00 902420 07 Jones A4, joint LAASI 1976 May British Independent A/L Vol.2 A.C. M Jones 120 3000* £2.00 902420 08 Jones A4, joint LAASI 1976 May British Isles Airfield Guide Ed.7 P.H. Butler 28 5000* £0.50 902402 11 Jones 1976 May US Navy Serials 1941-1976 Ed.3 P. Danby 100 2000 £1.50 902420 13 Robin 1976 June Wrecks and Relics Ed.5 K. Ellis 108 3000 £1.50 902420 12 Jones 1976 Aug British A/F: Past and present PHB + MCMcI two 6000* £0.20 902420 14 Jones A3 flat sheet 1976 Nov British Independent A/L Vol.3 A.C. M Jones 128 2800* £2.00 902420 09 Jones A4, joint LAASI 1977 May British Museum Aircraft KE + PHB 168 3000 £2.00 902420 15 Robin square bound 1977 May US Navy Serials 1941-1976 Ed.3R P. Danby 100 1500 £1.50 902420 17 Robin amended reprint 1977 May British Independent A/L Vol.4 A.C. M Jones 130 3000 £2.00 902420 10 Jones A4, joint LAASI 1977 May British Independent A/L Index A.C. M Jones 16 3000 free 902420 16 Jones A4, with Vol.4 1977 June USAF Serials 1946-1977 Ed.5 P. Danby 112 2500 £1.60 902420 18 Robin 1977 Sept British Air Arms BB + PHB 76 4500* £2.00 902420 19 Robin A4, new logo 1977 Oct A History of RAF Shawbury A.P. Ferguson 60 1500 £1.00 902420 20 Robin 1977 Dec Air Min P.H. Butler 32 1000 £1.20 902420 21 Robin 1978 Feb USAF Serials 1946-1977 Ed.5R P. Danby 112 2000 £1.60 902420 22 Robin amended reprint 1978 Apr On Guard K. Ellis 54 1500 £1.35 902420 23 Robin 1978 May Under B Conditions D.S. Revell 104 2000 £2.25 902420 24 Robin 1978 July Wrecks and Relics Ed.6 K. Ellis 132 3000 £2.30 902420 26 Robin square bound 1978 Aug British Isles Airfield Guide Ed.8 P.H. Butler 36 4000 £0.75 902420 25 Jones 1978 Aug A/c of Todays RAF R. Ward two 3000 £0.25 902420 27 Jones A3 flat sheet 1978 Nov A History of RAF Sealand A.P. Ferguson 80 2000 £1.60 902420 28 Robin 1979 Feb Wrecks and Relics 1963 Repro (K. Ellis) 20 £0.90 902420 29 Robin W+R2 new ed.) 1979 Apr British Homebuilt Aircraft Ed.2 K. Ellis 212 £3.95 902420 32 Robin square bound 1980 Mar Wrecks and Relics Ed.7 K. Ellis 152 £3.95 902420 34 square bound 1980 Sept British Gliders Ed.3 P.H. Butler 102 £3.90 902420 35 R Col 1980 Dec A History of RAF Woodvale 2nd A.P. Ferguson 68 £3.00 902420 36 Sandy 1981 Sept British Isles Airfield Guide Ed.9 PHB + MCMcI 32 £2.00 902420 37 Sandy incl fold-out map 1981 British A/F: Past and Present PHB + MCMcI two £0.40 Sandy A3 flat sheet 1982 Apr Wrecks and Relics Ed.8 K. Ellis 194 £4.95 902420 39 1983 In Uniform K. Ellis 108 £5.50 904597 49 jointly with MCP 1983 May Illustrated Hist of L'pool Apt P.H. Butler 78 £7.50 902420 40 Sandy A4 landscape 1984 May Wrecks and Relics Ed.9 K. Ellis 222 £5.95 904597 50 Nene jointly with MCP 1985 May British Isles Airfield Guide Ed.10 PHB + MCMcI 32 £2.90 902420 41 Sandy incl fold-out map 1986 Apr Wrecks and Relics Ed.10 K. Ellis 258 £7.50 904597 63 Nene jointly with MCP
Col 1, PUBLISHING DATE. This is generally the 'launch date', the month the title went on sale. However pre 1965 and 1979 onwards the date is that the foreword was written, generally 6 to 8 weeks before going on sale.
Col 2, TITLE. To make space for so many columns of information, some titles are slightly abbreviated. Most appear in full on an earlier post on page 1.
Col.3, EDITION. Some of the earliest titles were not considered as 'first editions', so in true aviation stype are here called 'prototypes'. Two titles are labled 'repro' for reproductions of the original book in a retyped altered format. The editors for both W&R 1 and W&R 1963 reproductions differed from the original authors, so are shown in (brackets).
Col.4, EDITORS. Most initials in the list also appear as full names. Matching initials to informal names
BB Brian Billington RJG Ron Goring DR Doug Revell PHB Phil Butler SGJ George Jones PS Peter Schofield PAD Peter Danby ACMJ Tony Merton Jones DJS Don Stephens KE Ken Ellis RL Rod Ludvigson GJRS G. Skillen APF Aldon Ferguson MCMcI M.C. McIvor RW Dick Ward MCP Midland Counties Publications UAS Ulster Aviation Society
Col.5, PAGES. On the early books, pages numbers included the back cover, sometimes the front too. Only a guidance as to book size.
Col.6, TOTAL PRINTED. As recorded in the committee minutes. * denotes the figures combine the original print run and a subsequent direct reprint (with no amendments) eg BIAL Vols 1, 2, 3 original print run 2000, plus a further 1000 in 7.77, 9.77 and 800 for BIAL Vol 3 in 10.76. Vol.4 and Index both printed 3000 on production. BAA 3000 pus 1500 8.78, while BIAG 7 was printed as 2000 plus 3000 10.76 and the British Airfields map 3000 on launch and a further 3000 a year later 9.77.
Col.7, COVER PRICE. Price is that on launch, retail over-the-counter sales, postage & packing charged extra.
Col.8, ISSN/ISBN. When the first 'USAF 1946-1969' title was reviewed in 'Flight International' (on a subsequent sales came close to selling out) it was commented that there was no ISSN book number. The reprint was likely number 01 of our ISSN allocation 0 9500780* +, followed by ISBN 0 902420** +, where ** is the book number and + a random final number. The initial 0 and the random number have not been included above for simplicity. Why a number appears twice and others are omitted is a mystery, but there was confusion at times. Some may have been reserved for amended reprints or new editions that never made it to print eg numbers 30, 31 33 and 38.
Col.9, PRINTERS. Printers varied with time, price and quality.
dup The M.G.A.E. Gestetner duplicator R-X,B Rank-Xerox, Birmingham Essex Essex Publicity R-X,M Rank-Xerox, Manchester Jones R.E. Jones of Llandudno Junction R Col Repro Colour, Colwyn Bay L Exp Litho Express, Colwyn Bay Robin Robin Press, Peel Green MAS M.A.S. own offset litho printer Sandy Sandypress Ltd, Salford Nene Nene Litho, Wellingborough (via MCP)
Col.10, NOTES. Include format if the larger A4 size, square binding and if produced jointly with LAASI or MCP (Midland Counties Publications).
FLAT and FOLDED SHEETS. In addition to the books, two spin-offs, were the A3 colour map from British Isles Airfield Guide. This was sold separately either as a sheet or folded (map one side, decode to the numbers on the back). Later used in BIAG Eds 9 and 10, with a new edition of the map in the book folded, and on sale as a sheet. Earlier the black & white line drawings of unit badges and aircraft side view paint schemes used in British Air Arms were rearranged as an A3 sheet and sold separately from the book.
COVERS. The very earliest (1961 and 1962) publications had a card cover enclosing stapled 'quarto' pages. The Rank-Xerox printed publications had a paper cover with a typed title, although some, such as the Swiss Register had a single colour on the cover. From 1968 generally a card cover with title and line drawing or photos(s). From British Air Arms in 1977 a 'house' cover style with twin 'wrap-around' lines opening out to form MAS for all books, except 'British Independent Airlines' and 'An Illustrated History of Liverpool Airport', but included the three produced with Midland Counties Publications under their ISBN.
SOCIETY NAME. The initial titles were published by the Merseyside Group of Aviation Enthusiasts (MGAE), which had been formed during 1956. This was changed to the Merseyside Society of Aviation Enthusiasts (MSAE) in January 1963. The mouthful that was the MSAE changed to the much more manageable Merseyside Aviation Society (MAS) at the April 1972 AGM - this was after the 1972 books had gone to print, apart from '"Aero"views 72' which was the first published under the MAS name. The MAS ceased as an active organisation at the very end of 1986, although it was a fair few years later that financial affairs were finally wound-up.
Last Edit: Jun 28, 2015 10:40:31 GMT 1 by viscount
Viscount .... Well that is just taking the biscuit!
I've never seen an original 1963 'Wrecks and Relics' Ed.2, just the 1979 re-worked 'Wrecks and Relics-1963'. The mistake originates in my 1979 researched listing, sorry. The list has been amended, thank you Gerry. I should have doubted the original info though on two grounds, the size of the print run and the style of cover quoted.
The MGAE monthly members magazine was Gestetner printed on foolscap paper (a little longer and shade narrower than A4) from late 1956 until March 1962. Then from April 1962 until December 1962 on quarto paper (foolscap width but a third shorter) stapled into larger blue heavy paper fold-over cover. This was also the system used, as far as I am aware, for the three 1962 publications. From January 1963 MSAE 'Flypast' was printed by litho printing by Rank-Xerox of Manchester with smaller print and photographs on folded foolscap, a big jump in both cost and appearance. Naturally this professional printed format was used for the next publications which as Gerry has pointed out was also printed by Rank-Xerox, but at Birmingham. Professional Litho printing permitted better quality, larger print runs with no extra effort! The question now in my mind is how were the two 1961 publications presented? Were they foolscap printed and corner stapled as per the magazine? Few will know the answer!
I know I'm getting old now that I have just needed to explain how Imperial paper sizes compare to A4!
Even though I am missing 8 titles/editions from my book collection (of the near 60 produced), I thought it might be fun to thumbnail illustrate all the book covers produced by the MGAE, MSAE and MAS in the period 1961 to 1986. Most of my MSAE/MAS books have been well thumbed and indeed are still regularly used, so have gathered a patina of finger grease, creases, tears, coffee stains and even sunlight fade over the years - this shows even at much reduced image size!
With the exception of the 1963 'Irish Aircraft', I have not included any initial booklets that acted as prototypes for the later true Edition 1 of a title. I am listing the titles in the sequence that the first edition of the title appeared. To shorten the post I have combined some titles with similar themes eg Airfield Histories or Ken's W&R 'spin-off' titles etc.
So how many have you got on shelves? How many were you even aware of? Mine are not up for sale though!
WRECKS AND RELICS Don Stephens/George Jones/Ken Ellis (and continued from Ed.11, 1988 onwards to published solely by MCP)
Editions 1 to 10 published in 1961, 1963 (both Don Stephens), 1968 (George Jones), 1974, 1976, 1978, 1980, 1982, 1984 & 1986 (all Ken Ellis). Eds 9 and 10 produced jointly with MCP but with the MAS logo cover design. Also illustrated are the reproduction Ed.1 in 1974 (A4 stapled, prepared by George Jones) and reproduction Ed.2 (called 'W&R 1963', prepared by Ken Ellis) published in 1981.
BRITISH ISLES AIRFIELD GUIDE Phil Butler, with maps in later editions by M.McIvor.
Editions 1 to 10 published in 1962, 1965, 1972, 1972, 1973, 1974, 1976, 1978, 1981 & 1985. Of these edition 4,5,6 & 7 were essentially minor revisions with updates of the previous edition - and probably all had the same style of simple printed colour card cover (some in different colour shades).
National Current Registers for SCANDINAVIA, SWITZERLAND R.J.Goring and FRANCE (in 4 volumes) by Phil Butler
Scandinavian Registers 1963; Swiss Register 1964; French register in 4 volumes (all covers to the same formula) 1964.
UNITED STATES AIR FORCE SERIALS since 1946 Peter Danby
BRITISH INDEPENDENT AIRLINES SINCE 1946 Tony Merton Jones
Published jointly MAS & LAASI in 4 Volumes. Volumes 1, 2 and 3 in 1976, Volume 4 & Index/corrections in 1977. Much later reprinted in one volume by TAHS.
BRITISH MUSEUM AIRCRAFT, ON GUARD, IN UNIFORM Ken Ellis
British Museum Aircraft 1977; On Guard 1978; In Uniform 1983 (jointly with MCP).
Specialist topics: BRITISH AIR ARMS Brian Billington & Phil Butler, artwork by Dick Ward, AIR MIN Phil Butler, UNDER B CONTITIONS Doug Revell
British Air Arms published 1977, A4 format; Air Min also 1977; Under B Conditions 1978.
AN ILLUSTRATED HISTORY OF LIVERPOOL AIRPORT Phil Butler
Published by MAS 1983 (A4 landscape format). Further much revised editions published by Tempus in 2004 and 2008 are also illustrated.
If anyone has a copy of a title/edition not illustrated, then PM me if you are able to scan and send by e-mail attachment. Thanks.
So over a period of time this thread has gone from initial question, through a building of information, to a complete list and now the majority of the title covers being illustrated and so doing justice to the toils of many to produce and sell so many books. The authoritive list sought by 'Gwoof' in the OP of this thread has now (eventually) been provided, if not surpassed now we have covers as well. Many titles broke new ground when first published and some still stand as the reference work on a topic even after so many years. I consider the activities of the Merseyside Group of Aviation Enthusiasts, Merseyside Society of Aviation Enthusiasts, Merseyside Aviation Society, Merseyside Branch of Air Britain and North West Air News Group all to be a long heritage foundation of the current nwan forum.
When images were replaced in late July 2021, I had the option of reducing the image size by a further 25% presenting it as a thumb-nail which could be enlarged on a click-over. However as that larger image came with a load of advertising, and covers could be enlarged only one at a time, I kept the much reduced by pixal number image rather than the tiny thumb-nail one. My choice, but if anyone would like a full size image as an e-mail attachment let me know.
Last Edit: Jul 31, 2021 11:53:39 GMT 1 by viscount
Viscount .... Well that is just taking the biscuit!
Another thread I've replaced the images into, so this is both a 'bump up' and appeal to try and get the cover collection even more complete (page 2 of the thread)
While I have been able to illustrate some 70% of the covers, there are some I don't have.
If anyone has the following titles on their bookshelves, could they make a straightforward scan of the front cover and attach it as an e-mail to me. PM me if you need my e-mail. I'll download it and adjust to the pixel width, tidy up as necessary etc and post here.
Most of the titles I'm missing are early ones, so are rare; while the British Isles Airfield Guides had very similar covers over 5 editions with only minor changes in image size or the shade of card used for the cover, the main 'tell' being the copyright date inside the back cover!
Wrecks & Relics Ed.1 Don Stephens 1961 Wrecks & Relics Ed.2 Don Stephens 1963 Wrecks & Relics Ed.3 George Jones 1968 British Isles Airfield Guide Ed.1 Phil Butler 1962 British Isles Airfield Guide Ed.6 Phil Butler 1974 British Isles Airfield Guide Ed.7 Phil Butler 1976 Scandinavian Register Ed.- R J Goring 1963 Air Min Ed.- Phil Butler 1977