KLM service LPL-AMS

[Deleted]

Apr 30, 2009 23:43:12 GMT 1 LPL said:

Noticed today that KLM are advertising its interlining exMAN on Smooth Radio, no mention of Liverpool.

If what John is saying is correct and it is £210 cheaper to fly from Liverpool with the same airline, they must be feeling the pinch at Manchester.

[sfp]

The Head of Air France KLM in the UK is to move to a similar post in New York.
See: www.ttglive.com/c/portal/layout?p_l_id=61139&CMPI_SHARED_articleId=2468289&CMPI_SHARED_ImageArticleId=2468289&CMPI_SHARED_articleIdRelated=2468289&CMPI_SHARED_ToolsArticleId=2468289&CMPI_SHARED_CommentArticleId=2468289&articleTitle=Air%20France-KLM%20boss%20heads%20to%20New%20York

Christine showed great enthusiasm over the KLM link with Liverpool. She was really interested in the 'lambanana' and received one from the Mersey Partnership prior to the launch of the service - not sure if will stay in London or move with her to New York.

Hopefully Christine will be a good voice for KLM in New York and continue to encourage travel to Liverpool.

[Deleted]

Travelled on Sunday 10th on the 1030 (KL1038). About 25 pax (none in business).
Returned on last night's 2055 arrival (KL1045) ~ 40 pax, (one in business).

It depends on how KLM are looking at this. If it starts to dilute the MAN-AMS operation, they may just drop a flight (there's plenty of use for the 737s), or put a smaller aircraft on the off-peak times. Unless things have changed a lot at KLM, in the past thay have stuck with the UK feeder routes on the basis that most of the pax are travelling on from AMS. Neither the HUY nor DTV routes (both well-established) run with high loads on a regular basis, but they've stuck with them, although it's fair to say that there's no easyJet competition from those two airports for the direct pax.

[sfp]

Garstonboy
Good to hear feedback on the service.

I am however puzzled by your reference to 737s - the aircraft used is generally a Fokker 70 with one or twice a Fokker 100 (engines at the rear of aircaft not under the wings)

Not aware a 737 has been used on the service (but I am not a spotter and may have missed a reference to it if one has been used, in which case I apologise in advance)

[Ryanairflyer]

I think your getting confused as he was refering to the 737s on the manchester service rather than as you say the fokker 70 occasional 100 on the liverpool. hope that helps

[sfp]

Apologies to all concerned. This 'age thing' has certainly got hold of me - I must concentrate and not 'shoot from the hip'

[Deleted]

No probs sfp. Having re-read my post I realise that it was not that clear.
Don't worry about the 'age thing' - I suffer from that too! Now what did I come on here for?

[conradmueller]

Travelled on Monday, 11th AMS-LPL, about 30 pax
and back on Thursday, 14 th LPL-AMS, flight booked full.
They have downgraded MAN flights with taking 737-800,900´s away and changing to smaller 737-700´s and Fokker 70.

[richard]

Not quite right - for some reason they have often tended to drop MAN capacity in the summer in recent years, not just since the LPL service started.

Pattern for this summer seems to be a 738 does the nightstop, with the occasional -900; morning flight is FK70; late morning flight is a 733 or 734; early afternoon is a FK70; late afternoon varies between 733 and 738; and early evening is a FK70. The FK70 flights are sometimes upgraded to a FK100. 737-700s seem to pop up every 2-3 weeks - todays late morning flight being the most recent example.

[northbynorthwest]

Have been reading the recent responses on this thread with interest, and have the following observations based on bookings noted over the past month.
1. Loads fluctuate wildly - with Tues/Wed/Thurs flights typically ranging from ok to poor. Mon/Fri flights typically have fairly decent loads. Sat/Sun typically ok to poor.
2. Loads on the first flight out of LPL in particular are poor - and this flight has a huge bank of onward connections out of AMS. Seems like local businessmen are perhaps sticking with Easyjet for their trips to/from AMS. The loads on this flight are a real concern for the long term viability of this route.
3. Best loads out of LPL are on the flt 1038 - again a large bank of onward connections.
4. The evening flt 1042 has seen a healthy increase in boardings. I assume that this could be due to more AMS based businessmen using this flight.
5. Inbound flights from AMS have more evenly spread loads. Flt 1037 typically has higher loadings than the other two - due to AMS based businessmen and connections in AMS from early morning bank of transcontinental flights perhaps.
6. Flights on Sat afternoon/evening are pretty poor - I would expect to see the last rotation cancelled before too long. Nothing earthshattering here - Saturday evening / early Sunday morning travel is low all over Europe / North America.
7. Flights towards the end of May have some very good loads - but I assume that many of these passengers are based on a recent fare sale out of AMS, and many others are Man Utd fans heading to/from Rome.
8. Flights to/from MME/HUY/LBA/BRS/CWL all have far higher business class loads - this is a critical area where LPL flights have been very slow to develop, and again is a concern for the viability pf this flight. They MUST get the higher yield business traffic both to/from AMS and more critically connecting beyond AMS. (And vitally, these must be at the expense of other carriers rather than just dilute the MAN-AMS traffic.)
9. None of the flights out of these other airports to AMS have Easyjet to compete with, so KLM LPL-AMS is a unique route for KLM. Easyjet certainly have loyal customers and some very cheap fares, and I don't see them pulling off this route.
10. If indeed KLM do cut back to two flights daily after Xmas, they will basically be cutting off the AMS based business travellers during this time frame of Jan/Feb/Mar. This will harm the morning inbound flights too because these passengers will fly in/out of MAN presumably. I hope that Mr. Pakey, etc are aware of this and are doing something to prevent this. They need to do whatever it takes to keep the flts 1041/1042 operating. Yes, other cities do see a reduction in flights during that timeframe - from 4 to 3 flights or from 6 to 5 flights for example, with ABZ/EDI/BRS being among those with reductions. A better situation for LPL would be a downgauging to a Fokker 50 for the evening rotation. Airlines do tinker with schedules frequently in the time leading up to a schedule change - so I hope that this is the case here.

[conradmueller]

Hi together, at least I´m doing my best to keep the route. Used to fly, amongst others, CGN-LPL but now I´m happy that I can get from DUS via AMS to LPL.
J-class has a very bad service on this route. It´s more like Lufthansa Eco Service and nothing like Swiss business class.
So why sould I spend 900€ for this.
And the Fokker 50 is getting very old. It operates on the route DUS-AMS. But KLM-Cityhopper has no more modern Props.

[Deleted]

Travelled to Amsterdam with KLM last Sunday afternoon 17.30 flight over 50 onboard and returned yesterday, 16.25 from AMS about 40 on the return to Liverpool

[johnoakes]

;D

Lucky 3--Prague--KLM--Eastern.

Roll on the next batch of 3.

My wishlist-----Air France--Lufthansa---any US airline.


Impossible---well ,who of the balcony boys could have envisaged the scene at LJLA international today.

As Billy Fury used to say--"Dreams can come true."

Someone once said to me that Liverpool airport would never be a going concern and that it would only ever have a tiny niche market.Better be built over with council houses.

Where are you now my friend???

[davel]

Well he was right in a certain way as the Liverpool Airport you were talking about then IS being built over, not with council houses but a business park. However the NEW Liverpool Airport is thriving and can only go on to better things as people like Peel don't throw money away and can see the potential. The new security area is at least twice the size of the existing and that means to me that more announcements may be forthcoming or am I being too optimistic?

[johnoakes]

Liverpool airport is and always be Liverpool airport--it may have moved a few yards but hey its still the same city and the same catchment area.

And don't we all love it and wish it every success.