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Post by kuga59 on Jul 18, 2019 16:33:55 GMT 1
Well taking this discussion further.
I agree with everything that has been said about runway extensions, starter strips, taxi ways and apron space and buying extra land/ buildings.
However the two main wide body aircraft B747 and A380 appear to have run their course with passenger airlines. The thought was that any extensions to the runway was to accommodate cargo aircraft and they would have their own facilities on the south side of the runway.
I read recently that the price of B747’s is increasing as they are being bought up by the cargo airlines, many coming out of storage. So they are going to be around for some years still.
Passenger airlines are now ordering B787’s, A350’s etc. Smaller aircraft, more efficient and better operating characteristics. TUI have already operated a B787 to the Caribbean from Liverpool. As these aircraft become more plentiful and more airlines acquire them, the need to spend millions on an extension for passenger aircraft will become less of a requirement.
The question then will be can Peel afford to spend and make enough out of cargo routes, to warrant a runway extension?
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Post by neil on Jul 18, 2019 21:37:01 GMT 1
Kuga59 wrote TUI have already operated a B787 to the Caribbean from Liverpool. they may well have done prob the wind was straight down the runway more than likely not a full load so less baggage and fright also the airfield temperature will will also play apart in the R/W length calculation
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Post by Deleted on Jul 18, 2019 22:30:52 GMT 1
Kuga59 wrote TUI have already operated a B787 to the Caribbean from Liverpool. they may well have done prob the wind was straight down the runway more than likely not a full load so less baggage and fright also the airfield temperature will will also play apart in the R/W length calculation Don't forget that going westbound over the Atlantic means headwinds all the way (often in the region of 100 mph iirc) = more fuel. The BA flight from LCY stops in Shannon for that reason. It's just handy that they do the customs and immigration clearance while the aircraft is being refuelled. If the Tui flight was meeting up with a cruise, there would have been a significant amount of baggage on board. |
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Post by kuga59 on Jul 19, 2019 0:12:28 GMT 1
Hi Guys
A couple of points with regard the above 2 posts.
No airline is going to schedule a flight dependant on the weather/ wind direction.
The BA flight from LCY is operated by a Airbus A318 with a much reduced capacity so enabling it to make the Atlantic crossing.
Remember these twin engined aircraft have to fly routes which enable diversions within a max time limit so covering your weather issues.
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Post by ronturner on Jul 19, 2019 7:15:17 GMT 1
As for those hangars.
If my memory serves me correctly, there was an EU grant to part fund the new Airport/Apron/Hangars etc. I am not sure exactly how it worked out, and who paid for what, but I seem to remember that when it was suggested to demolish them, several years later, or change their use, the possibility of repaying the grant raised its head. (Similar problem with the cruise terminal, such as it is)
No doubt somebody else knows the full story.
Any way I suppose if they need to be (re)moved or (re)adjusted, the bulldozers will be ready to move in on November 1st.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2019 10:03:48 GMT 1
As for those hangars. If my memory serves me correctly, there was an EU grant to part fund the new Airport/Apron/Hangars etc. I am not sure exactly how it worked out, and who paid for what, but I seem to remember that when it was suggested to demolish them, several years later, or change their use, the possibility of repaying the grant raised its head. (Similar problem with the cruise terminal, such as it is) No doubt somebody else knows the full story. Any way I suppose if they need to be (re)moved or (re)adjusted, the bulldozers will be ready to move in on November 1st. You are right, Ron. Some may remember that for a while, BAe owned Liverpool Airport. At this time they had a civil engineering division (BAe Consultancy) specialising in airports and based in Warrington. I did some work with them, including in Astrakhan, with a guy who had done some studies on LPL. He was from Liverpool - in fact I discovered that we were at school at the same time and he was very keen to see the airport expanded. One of the first proposals put forward was to demolish the hangars and the control tower, but it was quickly found that if they did so, they would have to pay back a significant amount of the (EEC?) grant which had been given. He had carried out a study and I was allowed to see it. The three principal points were that the hangars a) were unnecessary-there was no requirement for maintenance on aircraft using the airport at the time. One hangar is always required for undercover unscheduled maintenance, but it should have been built elsewhere, b) the hangars were built in the wrong place and noted that nowhere in the world had he seen hangars built at 90 degrees to and so close to a taxiway and c) that the control tower was built in the wrong place, because the view of the apron was very limited. This is why a new tower had to be built on the other side of the runway. My understanding is that the old control tower is now totally unusable, the reasons for this vary according to who you are speaking to. BAe had ambitious plans for the airport, including extending the 09 end into the river, but none of this came to fruition because the Consultancy division was wound up a few years later when BAe decided to concentrate on core business. Liverpool is not alone in this, and my own experience with civil engineering companies where airports are concerned is less than impressive. The terminal building at Barbados was rebuilt in the early 80s with a roof that could withstand the weight of three feet of snow on it. Why? Because it was designed and built by a Canadian company who just used standard drawings, in order to save on design costs. I was told a similar story about the controversial airport build in Grenada during the mid 80s, too. |
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Post by Ant on Jul 19, 2019 10:14:09 GMT 1
Should this discussion be moved elsewhere? As the last 20+ posts have had nothing to do with 'LJLA Movements Tuesday 16 July 2019' - and to repeat the above, Should this (valued) discussion be moved elsewhere ? MODS !! ... |
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Post by Beemer on Jul 19, 2019 12:03:47 GMT 1
Ant I have moved them all to the RESA thread as you see as it was the only available place. I am sure there will be complaints. Beemer.
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Post by LPL on Aug 11, 2019 12:23:33 GMT 1
My understanding is that after several summers when they flew out of Liverpool to the USA or Far East with an en-route fuel stop - which was not liked, the club now request a guarantee of direct flights. The operators cannot provide this from Liverpool - even though, when conditions are right, it is feasible. They are due to play in Istanbul this week so Liverpool should fly exLPL, if they dont then there is more to it than just 'the club now request a guarantee of direct flights'. If they dont fly exLPL then, as I believe the airport pays for executive facilities at LFC, should tell them what they think. |
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Post by andyh on Aug 11, 2019 12:33:14 GMT 1
Can we give the ‘club / customer / whoever’ must fly from Liverpool a rest? It achieves absolutely nothing.
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Post by liverpoolman1 on Aug 11, 2019 23:43:08 GMT 1
What it achieves is awareness. With the followings that both our clubs enjoy, the more that people are aware of the use they put our airport to, the better. Any business, airport or not, is dependent upon their customers being aware of their product, in this case, LFC and EFC are 'product'. It's all about marketing and it achieves much.
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Post by LPL on Aug 12, 2019 0:01:04 GMT 1
I see the South African 767 is in later today so maybe it's that they are using.
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Post by bluefox on Aug 15, 2019 20:23:38 GMT 1
Has any work started on the fencing to define and secure the RESA?
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Post by andyh on Aug 15, 2019 20:56:25 GMT 1
Has any work started on the fencing to define and secure the RESA? The fencing is pretty much done. Still some work to dig up the road and level the site. |
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Post by Airbus A346 on Aug 15, 2019 22:35:24 GMT 1
Has any work started on the fencing to define and secure the RESA? The fencing is pretty much done. Still some work to dig up the road and level the site.
....... it didn't stop the local idiots climbing around / over the new fence this evening and walking to the shore ! I rang the police and got an indifferent response due to
staff shortages (come on Boris get you act together, we need them now). I asked why the new fence is not topped with barbed or razor wire, and was told it was not
necessary. We were also treated to a local yob in a blue Mitsubishi Colt registration DV12 OOA racing around the GA road doing hand brake turns and wheel spins on
the gravel. This was also reported to the Airport Police Unit, 07764 656490.
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